January 6, 2005
-
Currently reading: Where is God When it Hurts? by Philip Yancey
Today I begin the study on the Overcomers in Revelation.
Another snowday for the kids. No school, I suspect a postponed winter concert. We had been spoiled by warm weather for so long, now there is 7 inches and still snowing. The ice is coming later.
Today I was thinking about how we can be changed on the outside, but our flesh laggs behind. I know that we have to choose to believe what the Bible says, and try to act on it. But sometimes it is so hard to do that, it is like baby steps. I am still new to this, coming up to my two year anniversary, so am not coming at this with years of Christianity under my belt.
Faith is a hard thing. If something becomes tangible, it ceases to be faith. It then becomes reality. Sometimes I think faith is like operating in the land of makebelieve. I grew up in a fantasy world, it was the only place that the horrors of what was going on in my life did not touch me. But it was just that, fantasy.
I watch some of the TV preachers, and read some of the books by the name-it, claim-it sort of teachings. Sometimes I think it is presumptuous. There are promises in the Bible, and I know that God does not lie, but are the promises there for everybody, or are they case specific? Sometimes a promise is quoted, like the one that is used for soliciting funds, that you will receive abundantly, pressed down… and when you look at the context you realize that they are talking not about money, but about the Holy Spirit and love. It might change the promise if the context is looked at.
Also, some in our church have been teaching about having faith for something, because you will have whatever you ask. They say that it is lack of faith if you ask and then say, “If it is in your will.” I have a problem with that, because I know my track record of asking things isn’t that good.
When I asked God to stop my father from raping me, he didn’t answer. Was it his will that this went on? Was I not asking in faith so no answer from God? When I was asking, I only knew vaguely about God from TV.
I would love to think that maybe God knows more about what is best for us than we do. How many times have we felt that a certain person is the right one for us only to find out that it was the wrong choice? How many things depend on our choices, how much do our choices affect our lives and the lives of those around us. I am so fallible, how can I pretend to really know what is best for me. At one time I thought best was being dead. We act on impulse.
So how does one pray? How does one ask in faith? What to believe for? So many questions.
Heather
Comments (11)
It makes me sooooooo happy when one (read “you!”) is insightful, intuitive enough (read “a thinker”) to see through the misleading approaches being used “out there.” Particularly, by the TV Preachers. Too many hucksters in sheeps clothing for my taste. Not that I am always right on, but I am open to correction if shown the error of my ways. I do not perceive they are. And I have np brushing aside faulty cricitism, sarcasm and cynism most of the time, either. I am highly nalytical and even more highly self-analytical. i try to kick myself in the butt hard enough that no one will be able to kick me harder. I ahte learning the hard way, especially when it is avoidable.
I disagree with your idea that faith is limited to the metaphysical, limited to only the unseen. Good works are faith in action and can be readily seen, for example. Prophesy is the fulfillment of faith but does not stop being of faith once fulfilled. My faith is based on what I have seen leading me to have assurance in what I have not yet seen. They work in tandem. All of it is faith. Does that make any sense to you? Maybe I am confusing my more generic use of the term with your more specific use?
The word specifically says we have to ask “according to His will” What do they think, God is some celestial Santa Claus, giving whatever is asked for? What if two ask for opposities? What does He do then? It takes knowing His word well enough to know Him and His will. That is not easy and takes time, study and much prayer. Takes drawing closer. Agree?
Keep up the good fight. You are on the right track, heading in the right direction.
I don’t think you can pray effectively unless it’s in faith. One of the errors of these name-it-and-claim preachers is precisely this principle. Their concept of faith really amounts to a positive-mental attitude (I can get that kind of teaching from Opera). Unfortunately, they have a lot of people praying for things they don’t have the faith to ask for. I think many of them end up discouraged and frustrated with prayer.
Your question about knowing what to pray for is a tough one. What I do when I don’t know what to pray for is to simply pray in the Spirit. I don’t know if you’re Spirit filled, but if you are and you don’t know what to pray for allow the Spirit to pray through you. What you’ll discover is that in doing so you will be edified by the Spirit. Often times when I pray in the Spirit, I’ll sense what God is wanting me to pray for and then I can pray in English. At times I’ve even received insight into someone’s life so that I can more effectively intercede for them. This process enlarges our faith making it easier as time goes by except that God then calls us to pray for more challenging things and it becomes hard again.
Another effective principle in prayer is to pray in God’s language or to pray the Scriptures. There’s a great book by Judson Cornwall called Praying the Scriptures that I found very enlightening.
Finally, the most effective thing I’ve found in prayer is to focus on praying for others. I sometimes find it hard to pray for myself because I feel foolish or self-centered, but when I pray for others I can let it all out and not feel ashamed. To me it can make for a far more gratifying experience.
Where to begin … hard to see the screen with my eyes getting all watery. I think I will start with what you said about faith. God does not want us to have “blind faith” in Him. Evidence of God’s existence and His love for us in essence strengthens faith. He wants us to return His love for Him. In order to love someone, one must know that person. God reveals Himself to us in many ways so we can get to know Him better, through Scripture, through His creation, through the love of another that wears His name, through personal experience, so many ways. Peter said, “sanctify Christ as Lord in your hearts, always being ready to make a defense to everyone who asks you to give an account for the hope that is in you …” One cannot make a defense without evidence. Jesus reproved Thomas for doubting, but Thomas didn’t just doubt the possibility, he doubted outright eyewitness reports from people he knew and was very close too. If he couldn’t even believe his friends who were obviously very excited about the wonderful news of Jesus’ resurrection … Paul mentioned in Romans that we can see evidence for God in the wonders of creation so that no one has a real excuse to not believe. I remember in science that my teacher tried to explain that a rainbow was just an illusion of the sun’s different types of radiation reflecting off of water droplets in the atmosphere. He then asked if anyone had lost their “faith in the promise of the rainbow”. Most of the kids who did believe the Bible were a little dejected, but to me it was amazing how God would create this “scientific phenomenon” so that we could see the water was in the atmosphere and not once again flooding the whole earth. For me, the evidence of how a rainbow was formed strengthened my wonder and fascination.
The other part you said about praying and how certain things could be in God’s will … Oh how I wish I could just reach out and give you a warm gentle hug. I do not want to sound cold here. If not for my own personal experience, I would not say it at all for fear of being like Job’s “friends”. So let me just say before I continue that I have been in a similar (not same, of course) situation of sexual abuse from someone that should have loved me (not any of my blood relatives, but I sometimes wonder if it is easier to deal with if it is a one time situation from a stranger). Again, it goes back to freedom of choice. Your will was violated by someone whose will was stronger and who took complete advantage of that fact. I can understand your anger. I can feel the pain. But God is not to blame for what your father chose to do. NEITHER ARE YOU TO BLAME! Yes God let it happen. He let your father have the freedom to choose his actions. Your father chose evil. God gives you that same freedom to choose. You can choose good. You can thank the Lord that He protected you in that you survived, in that He stayed your arm from destroying yourself, in that He gave you time to come to Him in hope and in love rather than allowing you to end everything while you were lashing out in anger and rejecting Him . You have come so far now that you have accepted God’s grace. He will continue to work in you, and He can work through your experience to reach out to others who do not think they are worthy of His love. Please remember that even after a person has healed from a great trauma, the scars often remain.
Heather, you are such a blessing. I thank God that you came my way.
Dear snowberry – I don’t think you would ever sound like one of Job’s friends to me. You make some interesting points. The first prayer I prayed to God before I got saved was I believe God created the universe. That was as far as I could go. I stumbled on the pastor that I speak of here when he was teaching Romans. Romans is a tough book when you are angry at God and having a hard time dealing with issues of God’s abandonment. But one thing did resonate as truthful, the idea that the creation speaks of the existence of God even to a heathen. And I was a heathen. But I could see the interconnectedness of nature, hence it was easy to believe in a Creator God.
Interesting point about Thomas. I never thought that the unbelief was more because he did not accept the testimony of his friends whom he should have trusted. But I could see the wanting to see personally. Sometimes I wish God would make faith more easy to deal with, more tangible. But I can also see that, given my personality, I used to drive my therapists nuts with demands and needs. Perhaps if God took care of one need, another would surface. I just don’t want to use God like a kid in a candystore. I am more comfortable asking God in prayer for others. I kind of have the idea that I don’t matter. That I don’t want to bother God. But I think it secretly masks the fear that if I draw God’s attention, he may decide I should be out of His kingdom. I also do not want to be disappointed again. I passionately prayed that God would stop my father, and He didn’t. I do not want to pray passionately for anything for me, I don’t know if my faith would be strong enough to handle a “no”. And I am afraid of finding out that he will not answer prayer, period.
The rainbow thing made me smile. It recalled to mind the devotional where a teacher told her student that the Red Sea was probably only four inches deep where the Israelites crossed, and a little boy said, “What a miracle, God drowned all those Egyptians in four inches of water!”
You know, I don’t think there is ever an easier way to deal with sexual abuse. It is a violation that cuts to the core. It takes what is special and trashes it. It destroys on so many levels. Even one time cuts a rip in one’s psyche, and repeated attacks by a parent or a boyfriend is devestating.
I know that I am still struggling with a root of bitterness, and I try so hard to not be bitter. But when it comes to the statement that God gave my father the freedom to choose and he chose to do evil. I can see that. But WHAT ABOUT ME? Why didn’t God care enough to give me the freedom to choose not to be hurt. And in all honesty, God did not give the people who I hurt in my walk in life the choice not to be hurt by me.
I know that I have made a lot of good choices. I do not abuse my kids, I do not do the kinds of behaviors my parents did, I try to live a good life. I did choose Christ, and I am trying to change my thinking. But it hurts to think that there was not the safety that I needed as a child. It hurts bad. Kind of like being a second-rate person. And it did color my reaction to life, of wanting to be a people pleaser, and shy away from confrontation, etc. It affected a lot of my life in ways that are challenging.
Yes, I do use what happened to the best of my ability to help others. But the hurt is there. I wanted that nice, loving relationship. To feel loved and cared for, and I did not get that. And God did not provide comfort. Depending on the day, I am either glad that God spared my life, and disappointed that he did.
I do see the hand of God in the fact that I am saved. You have no idea how difficult that was. If you had asked any of the Christians around me, they would have probably written me off as alost cause. I figure that, if nothing else, I can be a poster child for how never to give up in the face of impossible situations to keep trying to lead a person to Christ. The seeds planted decades ago sprang up, against insurmountable odds.
I still do blame myself. I think the most guilty thing that I did was to not speak out against what he did, to not push his hand away, to not tell someone, and to not kill myself. I kept the poison in my room to kill myself and I didn’t use it. Isn’t that complicity in what my father did? I cannot forgive myself for not fighting.
Thanks for saying you feel I am a blessing, I consider you one too. And I am glad for you and many of the other kind people I have found here. It is making it possible to really search out these answers.
Teelow, you are right, good works are faith in action. But then again I did good works of my own volition before I found God. I think somehow God has to be in the mix for the faith to be there.
Hagana, you may be right about praying effectively if you pray in faith, but I am hoping that God takes into account where we are. Some have more faith IQ than others, some are building their faith, and unsaved, when they say the sinner’s prayer do not usually have much faith, but God honors that prayer.
I agree, praying for others is good. I am not always consisitent in praying in the spirit, and should do much more of that.I do like the idea of praying the scriptures. I learned about that through a Beth Moore Bible study, and I do pray that way often.
Thanks for responding to this. I am hoping that one day my relationship with Christ will be like breathing. Sometimes when I am singing songs in the car, I cry because the relationship that the songs protray seems so foreign to me.
Heather
Hi Heather,
I hope you didn’t feel obligated to explain yourself because of what I said. I meant it as an encouragement, but I knew it could sound like a lecture. This I did not want, which is why I mentioned not wanting to be like Job’s friends. If you printed out my Messianic study, I’d like it very much if you would look at what I wrote on page 6 about Psalm 22:1. I don’t know how “theologically correct” my thinking is here, but these are my thoughts, and though I am saddened that God felt He had to go through this for me, it also gives me great comfort thinking that even Jesus felt that the sin He carried at His crucifixion was so great that yes even He felt like the Father had rejected Him. We have hope because we know in the end that the Father had not rejected Him, but suffered through it with Him — I see the darkness of the eclipse as the anguish of the Father over the pain and the separation the Son had to endure — and brought Him out onto the side of glory.
Peace to you.
Romans 7:10 says that “faith comes by hearing (instruction) and hearing by the word of God.” I was the last one in my family to accept Yeshua (Jesus) as the Son of God, my Savior. I come from a terrible background and I have “tried on” Eastern religions, Catholicism, Paganism and witchcraft before believing in Christ. None of the others worked for me.
What did it was seeing the real — and permanent — changes in my siblings and father, as a result of following Christ. Notice that I don’t use the term “christian”. It has been abused to many times. The term “Christ Follower” denotes ongoing action. Following Christ is more than just letting Him pay for your sins, it includes actively obeying Him and having Him in His rightful place in your life. We are born sinners and we are either a slave to sin, or a slave to God, who paid our ransom with His blood.
Within less than a year after first hearing the Gospel, my family went from brutal fighters who hated each other, headed by a physically and verbally abusive father, to people who cared and helped and prayed for their family and others. It isn’t possible to play act at something like that 24 hours a day and I was shocked by the change in my homelife. And so, after pushing away my brother so many times before, I went to him and asked him about God. And I am so thankful that he didn’t turn me away.
My faith began with what I saw. It made sense to me and was what I wanted, so I took a step of faith on something I couldn’t see. I began to read God’s word and realized that His promises are true. Every little bit that happened in accordance to His word built my faith up a little bit more. It takes time and knowledge to build faith, and time and faith to build knowledge.
People tell me I know a lot about the Bible. I never thought of it that way. It started out that when I had a question, I searched a concordance for verses pertaining to that subject. I read all I could. Now I read a good Bible study and different versions of the Bible, mostly King James with Strong’s numbers, The Scriptures, an English version of the Hebrew Bible and a good commentary like The Peoples’ New Testament. I’d also like to point you to Through the Bible’s daily broadcast Bible study. They study over a period of five years, simply and with great detail. Dr. McGee might get a little rambly now and then ((LoL)) but I have learned so much from this study.
Sorry to be so long-winded. Thank you for subscribing to my blog. If you have any questions, you’re welcome to email me or leave me a comment and I’ll try to help as best I can.
Blessings, Alyx.
God Bless you I have struggled with alot of why questions usually concerning bad things happening to good people and innocents It is still a struggle for me today . Someday we will be free from this world and be able to finally know how great our God is and how he was there all the time
The “Birdies” story wasn’t of my own child , the author is unknown. I received it via e-mail and felt it was worth posting. I myself have had experiences with what I believe were angels but those experiences were not in the physical form but more like a sixth sense feeling and calm mental voices. Quite enjoyable & nothing frightening. I always felt a very warming sensation in the center of my chest during these episodes and once over an overwhelming sense of calm. As my mother was dying earlier this year, in her final days she insisted that there were 4 very tall slender figures, neither male nor female, with a white glow behind their heads in her bedroom with her. She told us that they wanted her to go with them. We never saw them but I know they were there waiting to assist her on her journey home.
Wow you are popular. I can hardly get down to the bottom of your posts anymore. And I almost am afriad to say anything cuz everyone sounds so theological….but I can share my journey….
My son almost died at birth, my daughter was diagnosed with cancer at 5 months and we went through years of that with her, then she stopped breathing from her asthma and had to be trached. She has been in the hospital more times than I can count. My husband had cancer a few years back and then he had a breakdown from all the abuse he went through as a child. He is on medical disability and I cant work full time cuz alisha needs to have someone here when she is sick. My life has been filled with pain for as long as I can remember. But God and my family have kept the joy in my life. But I have soul searched…oh my goodness I needed to know why my life was so hard all the time. And big stuff. I still cry when I think of my kids being so sick. In fact I am crying now….
These are the things I have learned. And I hope I don’t get yelled at by anyone for sharing this, if they disagree. But this is from my heart and my searching…
1. Life is not fair. Christian or non Christian…life is not set up on a fair scale.
2. God is always there. Even if I can’t feel him, he is there. Our spiritual emotions come from the same place that our regular emotions come from, and when I am in pain or distress or sad or tired, my spiritual emotions are lowered also. But I still know that God is there.
3. I do not believe that God intentionally hurts us. Even in his allowing things to happen to us. Yes He can do anything. I believe that he could turn me polka dotted if he wanted to right now….but I believe that he is a God of logic and he set the world in a beautiful and logical motion…and when we sinned at the garden of eden the whole thing got corrupted and broken. He is here with us in every breath and beat of our heart. He knows all, and sees all and is all. But we are not puppets and since there is sin in the world, I think it takes a logical course. Yes people abuse, but when that happens the same feelings come to the person abused and they live with the same brokeness. When people get cancer it acts the same way, as does asthma, hurricanes, even tsunamies. My daughter was not handpicked by God to have cancer as some people have said. I just dont beleive that. I belive that because of the sin of the world cancer happens, but it happens randomly. I can’t say that God does not heal. but I think the problem comes in when people interpret healing. I have seen so much death in the hospitals, it is cruel to think that God picks and chooses who he wants to live and die. I know a lot of people will be getting mad at me here. But death happens to us all. And so does sin. God is with us all the way, but people die in the most horrible ways, and if you say that all deaths are scheduled by God then that means that he wants people to be murdered and hit by drunk drivers. It just doesnt make sense to me and I see God as having so much logic. Please no one yell at me here. I have been through so much pain in my life, and I just have tried to figure God and this whole life of mine out. He loves me and knows my heart. He is not raining down fire and brimstone, cuz I have to try and understand.
4. I believe the reason we have free will is so that we will praise God and give him glory willingly. If we have no control over what goes on then He gets his praise out of force not choice. Now free will then is a tricky thing. We can hurt and be hurt. People can choose wrong and so can we and so we do. all of us, hence our need for full grace from Jesus. So God was hearing your cries when you were being raped by your dad, but because of free will and the sin of the world it happened.
I dont understand the pain and why some of us get so much more of it. Right now I have to find another job and I don’t know where to find the inner strength to do it. But I have to. My husband is different now since his breakdown and I am lonely and alone. The weight of the world is on my shoulders, and yet I am so close to God. My prayers are constant and in my every thought and breath. He cannot be seperated from me and he sustains me. He is the reason that I am what I am today. But I am still living in pain and lonliness. The world makes no sense to me and yet I feel God’s love in the whisper of the breeze and in the colors of the sunset and in the brillance of fall. I feel it in the hug of a freind and the comment of a xangaian and in the love of my children. I feel it when I worship and when I cry out to Him in agony. He is there…and so is the pain….
In response to your comment on my last post. No I don’t have anyone to help me out or lean on. *cries* I am in a small group from our church and they are turning out to be a rock to me. But the thing is that only someone qualified can supervise someone who is having trouble breathing and alisha wouldnt want a stranger over her. And this life of mine is not going to change until alisha get married and I can go back to graduate school or get a full time job. She is just graduating from high school now and will be living at home while she goes to college next year. I wish I had family to help, but no they are not into that.
I know that you are right Mrs. Tiggy Winkle, I cannot imagine God picking people to have cancer or be hurt in a storm or anything like that. That would not fit into the picture of a loving God. I cannot imagine anyone having the nerve to say such a thing to you about your daughter.
An interesting thought about how people think a healing should occur. There are many ways of healing, and maybe healing of the mind is more important at a point in a person’s life than the body. Maybe after one thing is healed, then God works on the next. or acceptance, or other things. I can see that.
I value your opinion because you seem to have come to some peace in the midst of the storm. I am hoping to come to some kind of peace that way.
Oh I pray that you find a job that does not sap your energy too much, is fun for you, and profitable. I also pray that the eyes of your family are opened so that they see the need to relieve you. I am glad you have a group of friends who are a rock to you. Everyone needs that.
Thank you so much for comments and ideas. I see your points and am trying to come to the right conclusion on this. GBU
Heather
Comments are closed.