Heather;

Good point. Reminds me of the old adage “Be careful what you ask for.” …If I understood you correctly (please correct me if I am wrong) You say that you only ask God for what you need to stay in line with His perfect will for your life. I assume you are not speaking of material objects, but positive traits such as understanding, spiritual strength, wisdom etc….I am sure you ask of these things for others as well. ….I too ask for these same type of things for myself and others. I am a strong believer in prayer and I pray often. Do you ever pray for material objects, or for positive circumstances? (by positive circumstances I mean maybe a better paying job, a pay raise, a newer home, etc…things of that nature) Or have you ever prayed for something you have been wanting that has nothing to do with spiritual matters, but for personal pleasure? I think it is okay to pray for such things. I believe that God wants us to enjoy personal pleasures, as long as no harm comes to others or ourselves while obtaining them.

I also believe that anything God gives us in life would not take away from his perfect will in our lives. It’s not the objects, circumstances, or events that turn people from God. Instead it is how we choose to handle such things and circumstances.

Lets use Marty for an example.(since you brought him up) I cannot speak for Marty, but by communicating with him I know that he is happy with who he is. His life is not in “shambles” he is content with his spirituality, he has a tremendous level of tolerance and love for all people, and while he will sometimes speak his mind when he does not agree with something, he still accepts and respects the views of the other person. Now I must ask you…. based upon knowing these things; do you believe that he is not following Gods perfect will?

Everyone knows what is best for their own life. Yes I do believe that many things are in God’s hands. However, God works through us not for us. A life is only in shambles if we allow it to be, and even in those hard times and moments of despair, when it seems our life is in “shambles” Could it be possible that we are experiencing these things because they to are part of Gods perfect will?

I look forward to your insight on these questions…thanks for replying! Hope your having a blessed day!

Hello Again!

Thanks for you reply to my questions. Also thank you for taking the time to fully explain all of your answers, not many people would do that…….

You wrote: **I have to tell you that if you have not read my Testimony that you may want to do so, for I really do believe that our past colors our perception of God.  I spent 40 years hating God, into the new age thinking, and having a grand old time baiting Christians. I mocked a lot of things that now I value so highly. God has done a miracle in my life that I never believed possible, and I spent 40 years trying to do things my way, and that did not work. In the almost five years that I have accepted Jesus as my Lord and Savior more has been done for my good than in all the other years of trying to do things my way. You ask if I ever ask God for personal things, that are not related to spiritual matters. Of course. God has become like a father to me (a good father), and in the morning and during the day we talk lots. I start my day reminding myself the He is the Lord over my life, I confess sins as soon as I perceive that I have done them, I talk with him much the same way as I talk to a friend of mine. I also know that He knows what I need before I ask it, yet He also likes us to ask and talk with Him. So if I see something I like, I ask. And like a loving father, I know that He will not always instantly snap at my command and sometimes he will answer “no”. But for me, what I value the most is the relationship with Him, and that is what I mostly seek. Things will pass away, but my relationship with Him is eternal. I guess as you get older, you begin to realize that life isn’t about things as much as it is about love and relationships.**

My Reply:

I do hope that you do not percieve my questions, and opinons as being “mocking” or that my intentions are to “bait” you as a Christian. If I have ever given you that impression then please accept my apology. I tend to ask a lot of questions by nature. I do not claim to know everything and I enjoy hearing (in this case reading) the beliefs, and ideas of others as it pertains to spiritual matters. Many times it is diffuiclt to determine the motives of others in a text based environment such as xanga, we cannot see facial expressions, tone of voice, etc. Sometimes people come across in a different light then orginally intended. I agree with you when you say that God knows our needs and wants before we ask him. In fact I believe he knows them before we do! Same with our sins, and mistakes. He knows what we are going to do before we even know. You and I share similar views on prayer. When I pray it is just like talking to a friend. I do pray for things, and for people. However, I view prayer as part of my relationship with God. Just as I would call a close friend or family member on the telephone and talk…Prayer is my direct line to God, and I never have to worry about the line being busy or getting a darn answering machine lol…. I do ask for guidance everyday, and I thank God for all of the blessings in my life. I am not formal in my prayer, nor am I routine about it. I talk to the lord as I would a constant companion that is with me always. To be honest, I cannot remember the last time I asked God for material possessions. I am not a very materialistic person at all, but I always thank him for the things I do have. I do not think there is a right or wrong way to pray to Our Father.

You Wrote**** I to have tolerance and love for people, but tolerance by the real definition of tolerance. Today tolerance has taken on an added meaning, which is to tolerate you have to agree that what I believe is true. But the real definition of tolerance is that you can accept that others believe differently from you. I can accept that his belief structure is different, that is fine, but I do not accept that what he is believing is true. No, I do not believe he is following God’s perfect will. I accept the Bible as truth – and in the Bible it clearly states that there is no other way to salvation except through Jesus Christ, anything that is not of Jesus and God will not bring you to salvation. Marty, and I suppose you because I have seen your posts with Marty, seem to think that it is perfectly ok to combine the best parts of many different religions and come up with one that suits you. According to my belief structure that does not work, for I believe there is one way. Now, I can tolerate your choice to have a smorgasborg religion, but that does not make me have to accept it as true. As I have told Marty in the past, something cannot be true and false simultaneously. You cannot combine Christianity (only one God) with Hinduism (many) gods. You have to pick and choose one system. I know the Bible is truth, so that means that not only do I accept the good, touch-feely aspects of God, but also the fact that He is a judge and that there will be judgment. I accept it all. And I accept God as Sovereign in my life. I will not push my faith down Marty’s throat, but I had answered his questions honestly when he came to my site. But now that I have found out that he likes to come and leave comments to try and get me riled up, I won’t play that game.*****

MyReply:

I completly understand what you mean about tolerance. In fact, you should never have to agree with something that goes against your beliefs. If you did, then that would make you a hypocrite to your own beliefs. I think a better way to describe tolerance in the spiritual sense; is accepting that although you do not believe another persons faith to be true, you do accept the fact that it is true for that person. The true definition of the word tolerance is; “sympathy or indulgence for beliefs or practices differing from or conflicting with one’s own.” This means being sensitive and as understanding as possible to others that believe differently. I cannot speak for Marty as far as what it is exactly that he believes about God. But I think that you have misunderstood my beliefs. I do not mix beliefs from different religions. I am a Christian. I believe Jesus when he said the only way to the Father was through him. I believe in the teachings of Christ that are contained in the Bible, and Jesus is my lord. It is true that I question many of the teachings found in the Bible, and I know that there are many, many more teachings from Christ that are not written. It is true that I do not entirely embrace the Bible as a whole. There is far to much evidence that proves the Bible we read today is not in it’s orginal form. I do however believe that most of what we read about Christ in the NT is fairly accurate, I do wish we knew more of his teachings that were never written down. I believe that the OT contains beautiful and enlightening spiritual text. Some of it fact, but sadly much as been tampered with for various purposes over the ages. Same thing with the NT. But, Jesus’ teachings are mainly consistent and do not contain massive contridictions. But I do feel that his words are often misunderstood, misinterpretated, and taken out of context from their true meaning. I understand that you believe differently and I respect that, I would never try to shove my beliefs down your throat. I may at times speak about my beliefs, explain them, and I often get excited. I am sure you know how it feels when something reasonates so deeply in your spirit, you just want to tell people about it. I know that is how I sometimes feel. I do not expect everyone to agree with me on the subject. Am I making sense? You are right when you say; something cannot be both true and false. There can only be ONE truth. But, not everyone is going to agree on what the truth is. What is truth to one person is false to another. I do not think Marty is trying to get you riled up. Marty has is own truth, and he enjoys sharing it. In many ways Marty and I are a lot alike; we both like to challenge others with our own knowledge. I do not know if he and I share the same exact spiritual beliefs, but we do share the same tolerance towards others, and excitement about our spirituality. We both have a questioning nature. When myself or Marty questions you about a specific belief it is not done to insult or to get you riled up. We are actually trying to get a better understanding, in turn we often will tell you why we either agree or disagree. As I said it is difficult for me to speak for Marty personally. And If I have portrayed his intentions wrong I do hope that he will correct me.

You Wrote****I do not see God wanting pain and suffering in our life, that is the province of satan (whom you say is a Christian invention – your note to Marty), but God can take our shambles and restore it, and turn the ashes of our lives into something beautiful. But that takes yielding to Him, and allowing Him to work through us.****

My Reply;

Yes Satan as an entitity is a Christian diety. My note to Marty was in regards to your comment about Anton LaVey who as you probably know was the founder of “the Church of Satan.” What I was trying to relate is the fact that LaVey satanists, do not worship the Christian Satan. Christianity is the only religion that reconizes an entitity named Satan. LaVey used the word Satan for several reasons…….but I do not want to go off topic…There are many cases within the bible of God causing pain and suffering, I do not think he WANTS us to have turmoil filled lives. However, we all as humans experience some kind of pain and suffering in our lifetime, some more than others. It is easy to say that some evil being named satan caused all of the turmoils we go through. Often times we cause it ourselves, sometimes it is caused by others, and there are times when acts from God may cause us pain and suffering. But none of that is important…what you said about God restoring us is the whole point. We may not always understand the trials we go through, but each one makes us not only stronger individuals, but stronger in faith as well. Think about all the trials in your life…they have made you the person you are today. I read your testimony, I know that you have suffered a great deal…and I cannot make any excuse, or give any explaination for the suffering you endured, no one should have to endure so much. But, at the same time when you look at it from a spiritual perspective it was part of the path that led you to be the caring, devoted, and faithful person you are today. You became a victor instead of a victim. And I think that speaks volumes!

I appologize for the length of this comment. I hope that you have a better understanding of where I am coming from and that I have no ill intentions toward you, I only seek to learn as well as share my own knowledge. If you have any questions or disagree please feel free to respond, I assure you that I would never disrespect your faith intentionally

have a blessed day~ Vicie